User talk:Ablake
Welcome Hi, welcome to the ! Probably nobody has yet looked at your edit to the Aegisfield page, but someone will. Please leave a message on my talk page if I can help with anything! CompleCCity (talk) 21:22, September 18, 2019 (UTC) Weird line breaks … … yes. Those icons use some CSS that collides with visual editing automatics. Either check the preview/saved result after your edit (which you did! :), make a section edit if applicable (which you couldn't for the infobox), or use source mode editing. And now a personal (rather than botted) welcome! -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 22:55, September 18, 2019 (UTC) Spoiler No template, yet. What would be the "huge spoiler" on Ajantis? -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 22:58, September 18, 2019 (UTC) :Say, do you know the templates over there on DAW? I mean, technically? I don't think, something like them will happen here. ;) :If you think you've found a place that needs a spoiler, you find an example (and the code to hide something in a boring, standard way) on e.g. Lium's Journal of Malevolent Magicks#Solution. And feel free to make it a template. :) -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 23:39, September 18, 2019 (UTC) ::Haven't looked recently, but as far as I remember there's a lot of JS involved, so the simple template code wouldn't work on a wiki that not also has the related JS (and probably CSS) changes/files/code implemented. And we lack the specialists for such things here -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 07:56, September 19, 2019 (UTC) Wiki writing formats Just saw your summary on Chaos: keep in mind that without further text, if it's a plain and brief "x bonus/penalty" in e.g. the infobox, the uses "-X bonus" and "+X penalty", no matter how the games do it. Alternatively, if it's within some descriptive text, you can omit the sign completely and speak of "a bonus/penalty of X" instead. Just telling. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 15:07, September 19, 2019 (UTC) Realtime "testing" on templates Please, don't make a couple of realtime test edits on widely used templates – create a sandbox, instead. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 15:09, September 19, 2019 (UTC) :Most features of a template can be tested in a standard sandbox: if you have the template code, just use your sandbox like you would do with a template: |< >}}. :If you prefer to use a specific name for your sandbox, e.g. the source template name after delete}} on it, and I'll delete it. (But keep in mind that that means work for me. ;) :It only gets more complicated and has to be in the template namespace if the template type is important, e.g. infoboxes may be better tested outside the user namespace, but some things still work inside it. -- -- You [[User talk:CompleCCity|talkin' to me? -- cC -- 15:35, September 19, 2019 (UTC) Dash Press ALT+150 for "–". -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 19:54, September 19, 2019 (UTC) :Sorry, ALT+'0'''150 -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 13:11, September 20, 2019 (UTC) Re: Aerie Infobox If you would take looks at the actual templates, rather than copying (often outdated) infoboxes from other articles, then you would have noticed that is deprecated and shall be replaced by . So, it's the other way round, and a lot of more work to be done … -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 10:31, September 20, 2019 (UTC) :Did I offend you in any way? When hinting to the original templates, I had more your article creations in mind than anything related to companions. :And what's this about "right away"? Am I not allowed to make an edit after you? You say, you have to see how things work here, while simultaneously making dozens of edits – without e.g. caring about how infoboxes are filled (there are some (incomplete) documentations about it). So don't complain if somebody fixes some things or make changes behind you to match what's currently done here on the wiki … :The use of the "coordinates" field is currently in discussion, although the template documentation clearly states to use "area" itself for it – just as you do. :What I like/dislike on your edit? :*good to insert line breaks for the optional STs :*at dismissed: "tent", instead of repeating "Circus Tent", would suffice; also, in general, not too much info to infoboxes: if e.g. a room is small and a character can't be missed when entering, it's redundant to give coordinates (Kagain, for example, wouldn't need them in his store) :*factual errors, regarding ''original games: :**AERIE06 is met up to level 06, has the complete inventory (bullets not checked), and the three WPs quarterstaff, sling and mace :**AERIE07 is met at level 07 and 08, has the complete inventory (bullets not checked), and the three WPs quarterstaff, sling and mace + an EXTRAPROFICIENCY (and not club) :**AERIE09 is met at level 09, misses the studded leather (bullets not checked), and has the three WPs quarterstaff, sling and mace + an EXTRAPROFICIENCY (and not club) :**AERIE10 is met at level 10, has the complete inventory (bullets not checked), and the three WPs quarterstaff, sling and mace + an EXTRAPROFICIENCY (and not club) :**AERIE11 is met from level 11 on, has the complete inventory (bullets not checked), and the three WPs quarterstaff, sling and mace + an EXTRAPROFICIENCY (and not club) :**AERIE12 is ToB :-- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 13:45, September 20, 2019 (UTC) ::Then please accept my apologies for I've obviously completely misunderstood the intention of your comment (especially "tell me right away if there's anything you're not happy about"). – Sorry! -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 06:19, September 21, 2019 (UTC) Re: Let's just move on Ablake}} I will. ;) If – and only if – this is related to my later mass-edit of changing "co-ordinates" to "coordinates" (and replacing commas with periods) – that indeed was a bit frustrating, but it wasn't about your edits, rather a consequence of my move of that page. And many more articles were affected. Something I forgot to mention before: please use Areas (Baldur's Gate) and Areas (Baldur's Gate II) for these things (which I haven't changed). And I'm aware that you did some research, else you wouldn't have chosen that specific formatting of this info. As for the BCSs – that's kind of my project, and if I'm applying changes to those, that's no criticism of the work done before (thanks for every add!), just … applying my style, my ideas. (Especially the scripts could still need some "interpretation" section, for the non-programmer reader.) Aerie's club: I haven't checked more deeply, but I know some of the companions have scripts/spells applied when joining that may change such things – as I'm currently not really in the situation to do some play-testing with her and as you apparently have the according experience, I trust you in that thing. (Though an explanation, a referenced script or such, would be nice to make this obvious for the simple creature files browsing reader, like me.) Consistency and necessity: I agree with you about consistency being a matter of importance, but in some cases I also tend to bend rules if there's some reasoning behind. (For example, would you name a standard section always "Locations", even if there's only one single instance?) As for this specific case: I guess, the infobox will contain again separate fields in a proper formatting in the future (see this thread), so it's okay to contain the info. (By the way, from which file do you get the companion coordinates? They're rarely part of the area files.) A final word, to avoid future misunderstandings: as I will let you know (see comment start), please let yourself me know if you can't agree with/don't understand an edit I'm doing to your work. Happy editing! -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 08:01, September 21, 2019 (UTC) :"My project" didn't mean that no one has to touch it – make further additions, if you like, and give them a different/improved formatting if fitting. (It's only "my" project because I created that whole category:Game source files.) :"EXTRAPROFICIENCY1 *is* Club" – wasn't aware of this, only looked for the "name", not the ID. :I also tend to always use plural, but in some cases I change that header to "Acquisition" (especially, if it's no real "location", but rather a dialog or such). :Companion coordinates: wait, you can't be able to make such minor adjustments of one or two pixels only by checking the position of your cursor when looking at the area – that's much too vague!? (I once (HDD crash) had a PDF file with a list of them, but never found out where the starting positions are defined in the code.) -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 09:07, September 21, 2019 (UTC) Item infobox Just noticed your changes on Kondar, and wanted to give you some tips for how the should be filled: *The "confusing" icons, the appearance parameters at the top, are described on the template documentation; specifically the "wo/w" ones are mutually exclusive: set wo to "yes" (and w to "no") if something appears in a base game 'w'ith'o'''ut an expansion, and the other way round if something appears in the base game ''only 'w'ith an expansion. **If these parameters are filled, the |appears_in (or similar) shall be removed. *Use link brackets for |other_names; perhaps uncommon, but would show the redirect (and if it's existing). *|damage_type is deprecated, use the damage type templates inside the |damage field instead. *If something appears in one original and one enhanced game only, personally I prefer to list differences by release chronology – just like you did for the weapon proficiency. In this case, however, as the "new" proficiency is the more commonly used (in several games, opposed to one game only), I would note it like this: Bastard Sword Large Sword There's more which you can read on the documentation (the most extensive of them). However, I'm currently reworking the template, so there will be changes very soon.-- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 09:48, September 22, 2019 (UTC) One thing I forgot to mention: images in (portable) infoboxes never need the "File:" prefix. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 09:53, September 22, 2019 (UTC) P.P.S. And their filenames shouldn't be written with underscores. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 09:54, September 22, 2019 (UTC) :Redirects? Yes, but please be accurate with the spelling. And those redirects, please add them to the category:Redirects, if it's a different name, or to Redirects with spelling variants, if it's only an e.g. capitalization thing or similar between editions. If it's about spelling, the EE variant shall be used for and on articles (as they have fixed many errors). :"Shapeshifter Slayer" was there before? Hm… don't know where this comes from. You could search for it in the TLKs (perhaps also on FRW), but if it's not there, then it should be removed. (And if it's only p'n'p lore, then no redirect is necessary.) :Such names are more important if it's about areas – because many of them don't have an "official" name, and the wiki often has used those that were established in various walkthroughs. :If you know how something is done correctly, then don't imitate the mistakes of others, even if they're legion. ;) :Underscores … are "_" – and it's bad practice (though for many editors easier to work with, and thus also legion here) to use them in internal links where actually a space should be. It's not "Bastard_Sword_…" or "(File:)Kondar_icon.png", it's "Bastard Sword …" or "(File:)Kondar icon.png". (Just told you, the mistake will have been there before your edit, haven't checked.) :About the ID code formatting: for now only implemented for the area infobox, but will come for items, too: the template itself will do this formatting, so it's redundant to set it on the page. (Downside: format breaks if lists are used, so such has to be done with line break tags.) And also the AI scripts: if there's only one entry (and not a list with the whole "BGW:Gsf/BCS/…" link), this is automatically formatted by the template if the BCS file exists. As long as it's not created, the name uses standard formatting. (And to not use red links for them, as was done at some point in the past, was a decision I made to not have too many of them – makes it more unlikely that they're created (or complicated to do), but that's okay.) :Adding the file type was guideline once, but isn't used anymore. :Consistency and current state of … let's admit it, the whole , yes … That's one reason why I'm editing behind recent changes, especially on new pages, to have a start with a unified layout. There are no real guidelines on this wiki, though there are the Baldur's Gate Wiki:Model Pages – but even those are not always consistent or show a layout I would like. So what I'm trying to do since … don't know, one year? Two? … since I'm (the only active) admin here, is to move away from an overly technical approach to e.g. items and spells and try to make the wiki more … beautiful, neat. My latest focus was on the item infobox, where there's the (earlier linked) forum thread and the very precise documentation. And as you're new here, are not only experienced with wikis but also the games, and as you're actively contributing, I just tell you all that stuff, so that you perhaps may support my efforts; or, to teach you correctly right from the start, before you get used to practices I'd like to remove from this wiki. :) :And, yes, that's a long way and a bunch of work. And you're right that even the "standards" of the previous admin, Islandking, are only rarely present (where not reworked already by me; I've done several changes to them). :Examples? I've started with a new concept for item articles with ornamental and semi-precious stones; but that's some time ago. When I was working on arrows, I decided to stop editing the articles and beforehand overhaul the infobox. And that's what I'm currently occupied with. If it's about creatures – my model pages can be found among the sirines, but perhaps they get more work when I'm returning to creatures. During my last playthrough, I started reworking area articles (WIP) and quests (see Category:Candlekeep quests and e.g. Entar's Son), but I had to quit playing. :So much for my "vision". You don't have to follow. You can tell of your own thoughts and ideas. You can just simply follow what is (not) established. You can leave again. You can think "woah, what an egocentric a**". You can just ignore me. Whatever. I'm glad someone like you showed up who's knowledgable of both editions of the games, knowledgable of the mechanics and wikiing, and in addition caring about recent comments and replying to them (and doing a bit patrolling). You know the DAW: if it's about (missing) guidelines – those I do like in general, and understand them as some basics for wikis. :Blah … :I'm talking (and thinking) too much … sometimes … :-- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 13:02, September 22, 2019 (UTC) Creature infobox (Re:) Hi! Haven't looked at the page, yet, neither at the creature files (is that construction with "neither" correct? ;) If you need to point to somewhere in these fields due to variations between games/editions, then please use the categories. If there's nothing to note, however, use plain text ("No race", "Mage", etc.). I've no strong opinion on the status effects question; I'd say, point those that have a dedicated page to these, but don't use Status Effects itself as a link in a list in the infobox: that's better done in a gameplay section. (I understand that this is inconsistent in terms of all/no links.) The icon templates differ slightly in the size and vertical alignment of the icon and should in most cases be used according to their name (placing one behind the info on article text, rather than introducing the line with it, might look better with the infobox icon). Uhm, I just notice that the article icon templates still need some work. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 08:34, September 23, 2019 (UTC) Your two templates Hi! A template:Bug is on my to-do list since a long time – thanks for the creation. This one looks very much like inspired by ''Dragon Age'' Wiki ;) Hm … together with your Template:Spoilers, I'm currently not sure if I like the design (and where's the BUG taken from?). Give me some more time to look at and think about them. (But you may use them in the meanwhile, nevertheless.) I'm also playing with the idea of auto-categorizing pages that do use them, or at least bugs. -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 09:10, September 24, 2019 (UTC) Re Hi. Would have been helpful to have the templates you're speaking about linked. If it's about and , then you should notice a difference in the text of the tooltip, even if they link to the same article. And I think, that difference explains the raison d'être for both. Agreed? ;) I hadn't checked the effect behind Rigid Thinking, but assumed it would be like you explain. On one article I had put them together, but IIRC that was about an EE-only creature. Was "Immune to Confusion and Rigid Thinking" or similar. Would that be okay/better? Doesn't hurt to list both, does it? (Could change in the future when the former is a status effect article rather than a pure disambiguation.) -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 16:22, September 24, 2019 (UTC) Re: Capitalization Perhaps I might have a different opinion on that topic as many other readers/contributors here, but *it's completely new to me that a page title should always use uppercases for every word; the [[wikipedia:Wikipedia:Manual of Style#Article titles|Wikipedia Manual of Style]], for example, says: "Capitalize the initial letter (except in rare cases, such as eBay), but otherwise follow sentence case … not title case …, except where title case would be expected were the title to occur in ordinary prose." – and the WP:MOS can count as valid for Fandom wikis *the , however, uses a different capitalization if it's about "names" (proper nouns, if you prefer) that appear in-game (as many, many games do – give each word in an item name an uppercase initial); still, a long sword is a Long Sword, and should use lowercases whenever it's not about the specific item … *… which leads us to your initial issue: I intentionally generalized the rope in the lead, moving away from a "unique item" (even if it is one) with a "unique (proper) name" (which is also the reason for removing the "The"). I know, we're here again in a big inconsistency thing, and I admit, it was only me who started to create all those redirects with capitalization variants – if I'm still using uppercase somewhere, that's because the redirects yet don't exist. For the other examples you mention, the Rod of Lordly Might and the Gauntlets of Crushing – I'd have to look at them, but they might be "unique" names, and thus deserve uppercases … they might … -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 12:37, September 26, 2019 (UTC) :I don't understand this as "pushy" or anything similar (what's "PITA"?). Exchange of opinions is a good thing. :) :You're absolutely right with the intention of making a quest "title" stand out. :And unfortunately even the games/editions are inconsistent regarding those: the original BGII has much more capitalized words in their quest names than the EEs which often changed that capitalization (that's why many quests have a redirect with variations regarding this); on the other hand there's at least one exclusive SoD quest that does it the other way round and capitalizes words that in other EE quest names use lowercases. Hmph. The wiki used in-game spelling from the start for most quests, though based on the original spelling; which does not mean, all words are capitalized. :Being a link makes it stand out a bit. However, in addition and uncommon for game wikis – but not declined by various community members with a lot of experience in many wikis to whom I made this proposal – there's the idea to indeed italicize quest titles; similar to "prose titles", but still using in-game spelling. That's one thing I wanted to introduce here one day – if you like the idea, make it so. (Boldface is no option, as that is not considered good style and shall be used sparsely; exception: first mentioning of PAGENAME in lead (and AKAs).) :As for your example: the exact (and non-varying) quest name from the EE would be "Brielbara's Baby" – with a capitalized "baby". ;) :Magical Rope :Perhaps the lead would need some rewording. If it would read like this, ::"Magical rope is … required to descend from the Underwater City down the great hole into the Underdark below." :…, this basically means, if you want to descend, you need some magical rope. Perhaps not that specific piece you can obtain here, just some rope with magical attributes. And then – you get a piece of rope that is magical. I always thought, we Germans are those people that use too many articles, and from my understanding of the English language it doesn't have to be a rope for this purpose, rope alone would suffice. What about "This piece of magical rope"? :It's only "unique" in terms of not being available anywhere else and because its name isn't used for any other item. But "magical rope" is hardly a "unique name" like e.g. "Varscona" is. :-- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 19:13, September 26, 2019 (UTC) :As for quest names on DAW – I haven't checked the MOS over there just now, neither do I currently have access to game data, but might it be that the quest names use all-uppercase words in-game as well? -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 19:41, September 26, 2019 (UTC) Thanks! Thanks for removing the link to Unfinished Business (Baldur's Gate) from the Nashkel Store again – I had placed it there to be able to take a look at that page (via preview) because I thought to remember some mod that limits this "exploit" and he buys only one for the high sum, but that mod apparently wasn't UB. And then I forgot to remove it myself. Storekeep. ;) -- -- You talkin' to me? -- cC -- 10:56, September 29, 2019 (UTC)